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#21 [url]

Nov 3 08 12:25 AM

I just feel like she is given so much attention and is trusted so much yet she seems to have a past where she did more evil than Dee ever did. She keeps to herself so much and it seems that she has secrets that can get Flamel and the twins killed. She could be doing more to help I think but she is not. She has this family hatred and it seems there is no decent reason. Also hate would not be the best word to use. More like I dislike her a lot but not hate her yet.

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dreamingofedward

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#23 [url]

Nov 3 08 7:12 PM

QUOTE
In regards to the attack by the disir and nidhogg, im really rather surprised josh took off after nidhogg and scatty, after he made it quite clear he didnt trust anyone of the group.  I didnt expect that from him.  However deep down i think he does truely trust scatty and that this could prove helpful, or maybe even harmful to him in the future.  Theres a chance scatty might have her own agenda.  Not to mention joan and sophie together are quite a force to be reckoned with.  I think we are just seeing the top surface of what sophie can do.


I have to say I was surprised at first too. But then I thought of all the times he talked about taking care of Sophie and his "hero" and protector tendencies. And while I am not sure Josh trusts anyone other then Sophie, I think there was a line where Josh said something to the effect of not being able to just sit there while someone he knew was killed (I don't have the book at work - or I would really never get anything done!) . I think he probably would have done the same - especially with the sword after feeling the first bit of power it had - since he liked that sooo much - for most of the characters. Even Flamel - I think - well, maybe not Flamel - ok, that one's a toss up.

QUOTE
i think theres more to the gifts that josh received from mars.


I totally agree. I think we have yet to see even the beginning of what Josh got from Mars.

QUOTE
he's going to have to answer to someone for the dept of being awakened


that's just a totally awesome way to make me connect HP and this series. hehehe flamelssecret/hysterical.gif the "dept of being awakened" - I love it! flamelssecret/hysterical.gif

I don't think Scatty is dead either. I think that there are plenty of hints in the end of Magician (and there were things in the first book too) which lead me to believe she will be around for a larger portion of the series. I will back it up with evidence later.

Final note, for the "I hate Scatty" comment - well, that just makes me sad. flamelssecret/crying.gif flamelssecret/crying.gif Because I think that she is probably one of the more trust-worthy characters. And, well, I just like her. So, I would like to hear more, like hitmanjls said, as why she isn't liked.

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#24 [url]

Nov 3 08 8:39 PM

I have Dee's view on Scatty. Over all. I also think Scatty is too emotional over a weapon. For the Josh chasing after them, I think he just wanted to get rid of Nidhogg because after it killed Scatty it would probably come back for Flamel, Joan, St. Germain, and Sophie. So it was more saving Sophie. I think Mars did something to steal knowledge from other elders and he gave all his own and stolen knowledge to Josh. He also gave some kind of curse to Josh that will cause Josh to be greatly conflicted with good and evil.

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Zephfire

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#25 [url]

Nov 4 08 9:31 PM

QUOTE (Kочевой волк @ November 03, 2008 09:39 pm)
I have Dee's view on Scatty. Over all. I also think Scatty is too emotional over a weapon. For the Josh chasing after them, I think he just wanted to get rid of Nidhogg because after it killed Scatty it would probably come back for Flamel, Joan, St. Germain, and Sophie. So it was more saving Sophie. I think Mars did something to steal knowledge from other elders and he gave all his own and stolen knowledge to Josh. He also gave some kind of curse to Josh that will cause Josh to be greatly conflicted with good and evil.

I am following a similar thought train on Mars' gift..I wonder if Mars has given Josh.."the other side to the story" so to speak..Sophie has the Witch of Endors thoughts and memories..could Josh have Mars'? flamelssecret/idk.gif

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#26 [url]

Nov 4 08 10:20 PM

I think so. But I also think that Mars was scorned by the Witch of Endor and cursed by her. Well part of that is confirmed when Mars begs Sophie. I think that this may lead Josh to turn on Sophie or Sophie to turn on Josh. I really need to get over my small dislike for Sophie. It is cause my little sister who is really annoying well her name is Sophie.

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dreamingofedward

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#27 [url]

Nov 4 08 10:38 PM

QUOTE (Kочевой волк @ November 04, 2008 06:20 pm)
I think so. But I also think that Mars was scorned by the Witch of Endor and cursed by her. Well part of that is confirmed when Mars begs Sophie. I think that this may lead Josh to turn on Sophie or Sophie to turn on Josh.

I think that's an interesting idea. But some part of me tells me that the twin bond will surpass all and will keep Josh from turning on Sophie. Not to say they may not have disagreements throughout the series - but I just don't see that happening. Then again - Mars mentioned sons turning on each other - and after the long say I have had, I can't remember if they were "merely" sons or twins....

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#28 [url]

Nov 5 08 8:10 AM

No way, I think that in the end, they will have defeated the prophecy, and have stayed together, and not have turned on each other .
Maybe that's just my hopeful thinking, and the fact that I'll be be in denial if they do turn on each other

__. ; Kelso Kunitz

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Spacecadet

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#29 [url]

Nov 5 08 1:34 PM

i think there might be a point where the twins go their seperate ways so to speak but i think in the end the twin bond will conquer all. Remember there's two parts to the prophecy, part A being one to destroy and one to unify, and part b being the two that are one the one that is all. insinuating some sort of fight or disagreement possibly between them then them coming together to restore order.

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#30 [url]

Nov 5 08 9:37 PM

I think that the twin bond will win the end but I am pretty sure they will turn on each other at some point.

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dreamingofedward

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#31 [url]

Nov 5 08 9:39 PM

QUOTE (Kочевой волк @ November 05, 2008 05:37 pm)
I think that the twin bond will win the end but I am pretty sure they will turn on each other at some point.

Most of us here love to debate individual points - any particular instances of foreshadowing that you can point to that makes you think that? I would love to hear more!

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#32 [url]

Nov 6 08 1:57 AM

Well first off the FIRST part of the prophecey is the part that says one will unify and one will destroy. And in prophcies the first part happens first. That is my main basis, that and it seems that Dee is really having an influence on Josh so is Machevelli. Josh was with them for a long time and he seemed perfectly fine with them in fact even more comfortable with them than he is when he is alone with just Flamel.

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Zephfire

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#33 [url]

Nov 8 08 4:54 AM

Good answer there Alex flamelssecret/clap3.gif Let's try this as a thinking point...Dee fears Perenelle's power.....

QUOTE (The Alchemyst p.47)
"Dee had always been on awe of the tall, elegant Frenchwoman.  When he'd first apprenticed himself to Nicholas Flamel, the Alchemyst, he'd made the mistake of underestmating her.  He'd quickly found that Perenelle Flamel was at least as powerful as her husband -- in fact, there were some areas in which she was even more powerful.  Those traits that made Flamel such a brilliant alchemyst  -- his attention to detail, his knowledge of ancient languages, his infinite patience -- made him a poor sorcerer and a terrible necromancer.  He simply lacked the imaginative spark of pure visualization that was needed for that work.  Perenelle, on the other hand, was one of the most powerful sorceresses he had ever encountered"
So who would win if they had a magical showdown, do you think he fears Perenelle enough to not want to risk that?

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#34 [url]

Nov 8 08 5:34 AM

Perry would win. I do not think Perry knows necromancy so I am guessing in a magic fight Dee would use lots of necromancy. I also think that Dee would more likely send some random elder to fight her and that elder would die. Dee is like the king of elder murder.

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dreamingofedward

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#35 [url]

Nov 8 08 9:12 PM

I too think Perry would win. I think Dee continuously underestimates her, and if they were to face off, I think he would again (and he is rather arrogant and I think that is one of his weaknesses and would also cause him trouble) and he would lose. I also think he fears her enough to not want a show down - which is why he tried to attack Nicholas while he was without her in the first place in book 1.

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Zephfire

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#36 [url]

Nov 9 08 5:39 AM

QUOTE (dreamingofedward @ November 08, 2008 10:12 pm)
I also think he fears her enough to not want a show down - which is why he tried to attack Nicholas while he was without her in the first place in book 1.

You have a good point there dreaming! flamelssecret/clap3.gif

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Michael Scott

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#37 [url]

Nov 10 08 1:07 AM

OK, exclusive revelation and a quote from book 3. I'm not going to tell you anything about this (so don't ask); I'll not tell you who is saying it, or to whom: “Do not attempt to capture or imprison Perenelle. Do not talk to her, bargain with her or reason with her. Kill her on sight. The Sorceress is infinitely more dangerous than the Alchemyst.”

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#39 [url]

Nov 10 08 6:28 AM

I too, think it might be Dees elder . And since I brought up his elder, I'm so anxious to find out who is his elder !

I wonder, who it's being said to ?!
Any ideas ?

__. ; Kelso Kunitz

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Spacecadet

Next Generation Elder

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#40 [url]

Nov 10 08 2:07 PM

I have a few theories as to who said this, the most likely of which would have to be dee, his elder, machiavelli, or his elder.

But we also forget there are a lot of other dark elders out there running around that we've already been introduced to. The morrigan (who is probably not a likely candidate), and bastet (who seems to have disappeared)

And for my crazy theory of the day.... It is possible even that Aerop Enap said this. We dont know about the past between Perenelle and this elder, so it could in all likelihood be someone like Aerop that would side with Perenelle only as long as the two have a common goal, then turn on the sorceress to have her taken care of when she least expects it.

Then there is also the consideration that its a character we havent met yet and know nothing about.

As for who its being said to again, Dee and Machiavelli are likely candidates but theres also a possibly it could be said to new evil characters that we have yet to be introduced to. Or an even worse thing maybe it is said to one of the twins, to do as biding for a certain favor completed ... if you know what im getting at.

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