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Zephfire

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Jul 7 09 1:54 AM

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Seemingly trustworthy to his close friend Will Shakespeare, but not quite so friendly towards Nick and the twins..whose side will the saracen knight choose to fight on in the battles ahead?
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#2 [url]

Jul 7 09 6:15 AM

Ahh, Palamedes; my favourite knight of the round table.
Never expected him to come into it; but good! definately on the good side.

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Moviebuff

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#3 [url]

Jul 7 09 9:11 AM

QUOTE (Zephfire @ July 07, 2009 01:54 am)
Seemingly trustworthy to his close friend Will Shakespeare, but not quite so friendly towards Nick and the twins..whose side will the saracen knight choose to fight on in the battles ahead?

i think he will, when he gave refuge to Nicholas and co he already chose a side, and the immortals and their Elders will not be too pleased w/ that. at this point he needs to either battle on or hide forever

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#4 [url]

Jul 7 09 9:16 AM

Not if he redeems himself by killing someone...

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Moviebuff

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#5 [url]

Jul 7 09 9:35 AM

point taken, but who? he hates Nick but he cant die seeing as the its his series.

I still think he'll stick w/ the good guys

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#6 [url]

Jul 7 09 9:41 AM

I believe Nick will die...
I mean, the twins can't progress to their full potential if he is always showing and telling them what to do...
Anyway back to Palamedes...
I think he wants to be good, but too scared of what the dark elders will do to him.

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Moviebuff

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#7 [url]

Jul 7 09 9:44 AM

i don't think he's scared. he's just like Hekate only taking sides when it matters most, when it's time to...

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Spacecadet

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Jul 7 09 12:29 PM

I think the deal with Palamedes is that he wants to support the twins of legend but he has issues and a history with Flamel, so It makes it difficult that the twins are allied currently with flamel for him to choose allegiance. I believe Palamedes several times he does things for the twins not for flamel.

The other thing that interests me about Palamedes is his ability to travel in and out of any shadowrealm. He goes on rescue missions with his green knights to save those humani that have been lost in shadowrealms. So I would say he is in general support of the humani but maybe not a flamel supporter. That being said we know there are many different types of shadowrealms so I think that makes Palamedes unique that he can travel in and out of all of them easily. I hope we learn more about this in the coming books.

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Bellus Stella

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#9 [url]

Jul 7 09 1:02 PM

So does the knight have an elder who gives him orders or does he just randomly save humanis when they need saving from the realms....?

i find him quite interesting as well, cant quite read him. He is definitly loyal to Shakespear and the Twins (i would even go by saying that is loyal to the twins in the prophecy and not Sophie and Josh persay) but im not so sure about Francis. It seems to me like he is repaying a debt or something, like he owes Francis... i dont know

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Moviebuff

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#10 [url]

Jul 8 09 6:09 AM

I think he saves people at random. only a handfull of Elders care about Humani, majority regard them as "curiousities."

and he's able to travel around Shadowrealms because he's made niceties with some Elder since he's neutral. but you're right there is something special about him if he can enter 'hostile' Elders shadowrealm

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Michael Scott

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#11 [url]

Jul 8 09 7:19 PM

QUOTE (Moviebuff @ July 08, 2009 06:09 am)
I think he saves people at random. only a handfull of Elders care about Humani, majority regard them as "curiousities."

and he's able to travel around Shadowrealms because he's made niceties with some Elder since he's neutral. but you're right there is something special about him if he can enter 'hostile' Elders shadowrealm
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#12 [url]

Jul 8 09 8:13 PM

I thought he goes into the shadowrealms to retrieve humani who are trapped there?
He seems to be a protector of balance. Humani don't belong in the shadowrealms, so he's returning them to their rightful place. Also I don't think he's totally opposed to the elders coming back to earth, he understands that just because the elders are powerful and not totally undefeatable. They still have their adversion to iron and various other weaknesses and he sees that humanity is getting even more corrupt from his earlier days.

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dreamingofedward

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#13 [url]

Jul 8 09 8:19 PM

I found the text that talks about Palamedes' ability... and why he travels through the Shadowrealms. Palamedes tells Flamel that they are not in fact on the same side just because they have the same enemies - Palamedes states that he and his brother knights (the Green Knights) go to rescue humans who have been trapped in the Shadowrealms. And when Sophie uses the Witch's memories to see what she knows about Palamedes, the wording states that:

QUOTE (The Sorceress)
He was an immortal human gifted with the special ability to move freely through the Shadowrealms and yet remain unaffected by them.
Seems to me that this isn't because people are being saved at random - but as if he has been tasked with the responsibility... he and the Green Knights. I assume then that he has an Elder who takes saving humans fairly seriously.

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Spacecadet

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#14 [url]

Jul 8 09 8:49 PM

There is also a quote by palamedes in response to Flamel saying there are no shadowrealms in London, Palamedes replies that he knows of two elders who have shadowrealms in london as well as several other shadowrealms including one that has an entrance near traitor's gate. Im wondering if the two elders he knows of arent possibly his and shakespeare's elders.

Also later on he tells the gabriel hounds if they dont hear from him to take Will to the shadowrealm Lyonesse or Avalon and that they should be safe there. Im guessing both are in or near london. Also interesting about these two shadowrealms, Avalon is where Exaclibur is said to be forged, and Lyonesse is said to have been connected to Atlantis, and is possibly where the Atlantis refugees fled to when Atlantis sank into the ocean.

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Moviebuff

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#15 [url]

Jul 9 09 9:59 AM

QUOTE (Michael Scott @ July 08, 2009 07:19 pm)
QUOTE (Moviebuff @ July 08, 2009 06:09 am)
I think he saves people at random. only a handfull of Elders care about Humani, majority regard them as "curiousities."

and he's able to travel around Shadowrealms because he's made niceties with some Elder since he's neutral. but you're right there is something special about him if he can enter 'hostile' Elders shadowrealm

Traveling through the Shadowrealms. Go back and explore this aspect of his character - no-one else has picked up on it
.
Michael

I'm not taking credit for this one, good job SC

QUOTE (dreamingofedward @ July 08, 2009 08:19 pm)
I found the text that talks about Palamedes' ability... and why he travels through the Shadowrealms.  Palamedes tells Flamel that they are not in fact on the same side just because they have the same enemies - Palamedes states that he and his brother knights (the Green Knights) go to rescue humans who have been trapped in the Shadowrealms.  And when Sophie uses the Witch's memories to see what she knows about Palamedes, the wording states that:
QUOTE (The Sorceress)
He was an immortal human gifted with the special ability to move freely through the Shadowrealms and yet remain unaffected by them.
Seems to me that this isn't because people are being saved at random - but as if he has been tasked with the responsibility... he and the Green Knights. I assume then that he has an Elder who takes saving humans fairly seriously.

flamelssecret/Agreed.gif but who? he was gifted this ability but not necessarily by the same Elder who gave him immortality. which means he is bound to, at least, two elders. nd the Green Knights, are they immorlat humani as well?

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Spacecadet

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#16 [url]

Jul 9 09 12:29 PM

QUOTE (Moviebuff @ July 09, 2009 04:59 am)
QUOTE (Michael Scott @ July 08, 2009 07:19 pm)
QUOTE (Moviebuff @ July 08, 2009 06:09 am)
I think he saves people at random. only a handfull of Elders care about Humani, majority regard them as "curiousities."

and he's able to travel around Shadowrealms because he's made niceties with some Elder since he's neutral. but you're right there is something special about him if he can enter 'hostile' Elders shadowrealm

Traveling through the Shadowrealms. Go back and explore this aspect of his character - no-one else has picked up on it
.
Michael

I'm not taking credit for this one, good job SC



Thanks but you did have some good points about his shadowrealm traveling abilities, like why would elders just let him travel freely in and out of their shadowrealms?


QUOTE (Moviebuff @ July 09, 2009 04:59 am)


flamelssecret/Agreed.gif but who? he was gifted this ability but not necessarily by the same Elder who gave him immortality. which means he is bound to, at least, two elders. nd the Green Knights, are they immorlat humani as well?


Yes a couple of good questions, and Im beginning to wonder some of this myself, are they possibly not human, and maybe something more along the lines of the Gabrial hounds or the torc madra, or maybe some other human/animal mixture that exists in the immortal/elder world. It seems like both palamedes and shakespeare might have their own "armies" Palamedes with the green knights and Shakespeare with the gabrial hounds.

As far as the ability to travel among the shadowrealms freely, im imagining its some kind of gift from an elder, and not just some ability he was born with or developed, but its possible that whichever elder granted him this gift was the same elder who granted him immortality (if thats even how he became immortal), it could be two different but im guessing its not. I get the impression that the elders (even the humani supportive ones) try to keep interaction with humans to a minimum so i think it was the same elder. I mean Mars awakened josh, and gave him the gift of battle knowledge and intuition. So elders providing two gifts (although awakening and immortality are not the exact same gift persay) is not completely unheard of.

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Moviebuff

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#17 [url]

Jul 10 09 8:14 AM

QUOTE (Spacecadet @ July 09, 2009 12:29 pm)
Yes a couple of good questions, and Im beginning to wonder some of this myself, are they possibly not human, and maybe something more along the lines of the Gabrial hounds or the torc madra, or maybe some other human/animal mixture that exists in the immortal/elder world.  It seems like both palamedes and shakespeare might have their own "armies" Palamedes with the green knights and Shakespeare with the gabrial hounds.

As far as the ability to travel among the shadowrealms freely, im imagining its some kind of gift from an elder, and not just some ability he was born with or developed, but its possible that whichever elder granted him this gift was the same elder who granted him immortality (if thats even how he became immortal), it could be two different but im guessing its not.  I get the impression that the elders (even the humani supportive ones) try to keep interaction with humans to a minimum so i think it was the same elder.  I mean Mars awakened josh, and gave him the gift of battle knowledge and intuition.  So elders providing two gifts (although awakening and immortality are not the exact same gift persay) is not completely unheard of.

exatly what i was going for, maybe he commands tigermen or lionmen, the former was mentioned in the Alchemyst.

yes it was a gift from an Elder, and you're right of course this gift and his immortality (if that's how he became immortal) may be gifts from one Elder. I was only exploring the idea of having two Elders bestowing him gift because he has a few Shadowrealms; and maybe the gift is that of annonimity in Shadowrealms that's why he can slip in and out unnoticed (probably)

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dreamingofedward

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Aug 5 09 12:16 AM

Posted this in the wrong place originally...

Thinking about Pally... wonder if we will see Tristram, Gareth or Dinadan. Would love to see Tristram.

Anywho... thought it was interesting that the research I have found mentions how often he rescued folks from attackes. I also found a curious reference to Palomides being present at the completion of Castell Dinas Bran - which is sometimes known as "crow castle", and so I wonder if there is some link to the Crow Goddess...

He also slew the "Questing Best" at the Lake of the Beast... I wonder if the beast is relevant in any way....


Ok... so Pally is referred to throughout the Sorceress as the Saracen knight... but I was wondering if, he is the same Palamedes from Homer too... I know we have seen many characters having our Green Knight is in fact the same Palamedes who outsmarted Odysseus and was stoned to death (or drowned, depending on which account you read)?

No double posting please! flamelssecret/rulez.gif - Roxy Sorry 'bout that. Gee, you'd think I would know better! hehehe... Must have had a brain malfunction flamelssecret/confused0058.gif

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Godsryche

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Aug 18 09 12:38 PM

I just had a thought about our dear knight -

What if Arthur was an Elder and that's why Palamedes is immortal?

Arthur was killed by Cernunnos with Clarent. Seems like an awful lot to kill just some humani, even an immortal one.

And now that Arthur is dead, if he had granted Palamedes immortality than the knight has his immortality basically locked up for good.

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Spacecadet

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#20 [url]

Aug 18 09 1:07 PM

QUOTE (Godsryche @ August 18, 2009 07:38 am)
I just had a thought about our dear knight -

What if Arthur was an Elder and that's why Palamedes is immortal?

Arthur was killed by Cernunnos with Clarent. Seems like an awful lot to kill just some humani, even an immortal one.

And now that Arthur is dead, if he had granted Palamedes immortality than the knight has his immortality basically locked up for good.

Thats an interesting theory, and i do expect that we will see atleast one or two immortal characters whose elders have died or been killed, and we know there has already been mention of one immortal who is suspected of having killed their elder, and is now immortal with no ties to an elder. However im still unsure as to whether or not palamedes is one of those characters. I think there is something deeper going on with palamedes, especially because of his extra ability to move freely among shadowrealms. We know interesting gifts such as these typically come from elders, so im pretty sure palamedes has one or is at the very least in close leagues with one, whether it is a dark elder, or one no longer living still remains to be seen.

We do however know that gifts such as immortality and palamedes special gift (if we can call it that) often come at a price. Im wondering if the traveling among shadowrealms freely is more of a curse than a gift. What if in return for immortality palamedes was tasked with rescuing lost humani from the shadowrealms and/or he was given the job of a messenger of sorts, ie delivering things among the elders living in the shadowrealms. There has to be a distinct reason palamedes has this ability to move freely among the shadowrealms and im not sure it was gift so much as a task given to him for a specific purpose.

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