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dreamingofedward

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#21 [url]

Aug 25 09 10:05 PM

QUOTE (Michael Scott @ July 19, 2009 05:43 pm)
So, have a look back in the Magician, when Scathach is talking about her family ... what does she say about Aoife ... then jump forward to the end of the Sorceress and see what Aoife says.

Michael

Interestingly, I found the section where Scatty and Sophie are discussing her family. Ther is not of the Witch of Endor, "a sharp-faced older woman with bloodred eyes and an ashen-skinned young man with blazing red hair." Then more discussion of Scatty's parents, but no mention of a sister. Unless the sister is the older woman with the bloodred eyes... but from the description in the Necromancer preview, where she is described as "young" and she looks enough like Scatty that they must be identical twins for Josh mistakes her for Scatty, I doubt it.

I couldn't find any other mention of her family. So, that leave me not sure what to think. Unless I missed a part in the book that contains more info. Which is possible.

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#22 [url]

Aug 26 09 3:08 AM

QUOTE (dreamingofedward @ August 25, 2009 10:05 pm)
QUOTE (Michael Scott @ July 19, 2009 05:43 pm)
So, have a look back in the Magician, when Scathach is talking about her family ... what does she say about Aoife ... then jump forward to the end of the Sorceress and see what Aoife says.

Michael

Interestingly, I found the section where Scatty and Sophie are discussing her family. Ther is not of the Witch of Endor, "a sharp-faced older woman with bloodred eyes and an ashen-skinned young man with blazing red hair." Then more discussion of Scatty's parents, but no mention of a sister. Unless the sister is the older woman with the bloodred eyes... but from the description in the Necromancer preview, where she is described as "young" and she looks enough like Scatty that they must be identical twins for Josh mistakes her for Scatty, I doubt it.

I couldn't find any other mention of her family. So, that leave me not sure what to think. Unless I missed a part in the book that contains more info. Which is possible.

re-read that part in the Magician yesterday, and I can't find any mention of a sister, and I probably skipped the part where Sophie saw those images. The older woman w/ bloodred eyes may be Aoife. It may have resulted from stress or anger. We've also seen Scatty look ancient before as result of stress and concentration.

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Michael Scott

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#23 [url]

Aug 26 09 9:11 AM

OK, so here's an exclusive peek into The Necromancer, which will answer some of the questions raised above. Remember, often the questions you are debating will be answered in the next book.

Ask me no questions about the following, because I will not answer them!

This is from fairly early on in The Necromancer, and begins with Sophie talking to Aoife.

“Scathach told me about her family. She mentioned nothing about a sister.”
“We had a falling out,” Aoife murmured.
“A falling out?”
“Over a boy,” she said, with just a hint of sadness in her voice. “We’ve not spoken in many thousands of years.”


Michael

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#24 [url]

Aug 26 09 9:49 AM

QUOTE (Michael Scott @ August 26, 2009 09:11 am)
OK, so here's an exclusive peek into The Necromancer, which will answer some of the questions raised above. Remember, often the questions you are debating will be answered in the next book.

Ask me no questions about the following, because I will not answer them!

This is from fairly early on in The Necromancer, and begins with Sophie talking to Aoife.

“Scathach told me about her family. She mentioned nothing about a sister.”
“We had a falling out,” Aoife murmured.
“A falling out?”
“Over a boy,” she said, with just a hint of sadness in her voice. “We’ve not spoken in many thousands of years.”


Michael

First of all, thank you Mr Scott! I've done research with my sister on Scathach and Aoife love triangles. The one most common is with Cuchulain. He was Scathach's student, as I mentioned, but went off with Aoife after training with Scathach. Hard love flamelssecret/goodsigh2.gif

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#25 [url]

Aug 26 09 9:53 AM

oooh, thank you so much for this Michael. I think I knoiw now w/c part you were referring to. No wonder Scatty looked sad when she was asked about her love life

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Spacecadet

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#26 [url]

Aug 26 09 12:28 PM

QUOTE (Taz 2601 @ August 26, 2009 04:49 am)
QUOTE (Michael Scott @ August 26, 2009 09:11 am)
OK, so here's an exclusive peek into The Necromancer, which will answer some of the questions raised above.  Remember, often the questions you are debating will be answered in the next book. 

Ask me no questions about the following, because I will not answer them!

This is from fairly early on in The Necromancer, and begins with Sophie talking to Aoife.

“Scathach told me about her family.  She mentioned nothing about a sister.”
“We had a falling out,” Aoife murmured.
“A falling out?”
“Over a boy,” she said, with just a hint of sadness in her voice. “We’ve not spoken in many thousands of years.”


Michael

First of all, thank you Mr Scott! I've done research with my sister on Scathach and Aoife love triangles. The one most common is with Cuchulain. He was Scathach's student, as I mentioned, but went off with Aoife after training with Scathach. Hard love flamelssecret/goodsigh2.gif

Thank you very much for sharing that quote with us

Also i agree I bet this has to do with cuchulainn, he is by far the most commonly mentioned man that Aoife and Scathach fought over. But sadly this quote makes Scatty a bit of a liar, as she has said in the past (I believe in the Magician) when she is talking to Sophie. Sophie essentially asks whether there was ever someone she loved and Scatty replies no. However if there was a falling out between her and her sister over such a love, to the degree that they didnt speak for thousands of years, and still arent speaking I can see why scatty would have lied about it.

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#27 [url]

Aug 26 09 2:05 PM

QUOTE (Spacecadet @ August 26, 2009 08:28 am)
QUOTE (Taz 2601 @ August 26, 2009 04:49 am)
QUOTE (Michael Scott @ August 26, 2009 09:11 am)
OK, so here's an exclusive peek into The Necromancer, which will answer some of the questions raised above.  Remember, often the questions you are debating will be answered in the next book. 

Ask me no questions about the following, because I will not answer them!

This is from fairly early on in The Necromancer, and begins with Sophie talking to Aoife.

“Scathach told me about her family.  She mentioned nothing about a sister.”
“We had a falling out,” Aoife murmured.
“A falling out?”
“Over a boy,” she said, with just a hint of sadness in her voice. “We’ve not spoken in many thousands of years.”


Michael

First of all, thank you Mr Scott! I've done research with my sister on Scathach and Aoife love triangles. The one most common is with Cuchulain. He was Scathach's student, as I mentioned, but went off with Aoife after training with Scathach. Hard love flamelssecret/goodsigh2.gif

Thank you very much for sharing that quote with us

Also i agree I bet this has to do with cuchulainn, he is by far the most commonly mentioned man that Aoife and Scathach fought over. But sadly this quote makes Scatty a bit of a liar, as she has said in the past (I believe in the Magician) when she is talking to Sophie. Sophie essentially asks whether there was ever someone she loved and Scatty replies no. However if there was a falling out between her and her sister over such a love, to the degree that they didnt speak for thousands of years, and still arent speaking I can see why scatty would have lied about it.

I'm a little afraid that Aoife's sadness could mean that Cuchulainn is dead. Or, hopefully, it means that she only thinks he is dead and he shows up to the surprise of all. This has happened in the series before; Perenelle was surprised to find Areop-enap alive and well after she thought she had killed the Elder. Maybe Cuchulainn has been hiding somewhere all these years.

Or I am completely wrong, and my speculation has been in vain. Still, I believe that he would be an awesome character.

Also, I thought I should just mention that Cuchulainn had actually asked Scathach before his fight with Aoife what she loved most in the world, and it turned out to be her chariot, charioteer, and horses. Just when she was about to deliver the killing blow after breaking Cuchulainn's sword, Cuchulainn pointed the other way and said that her chariot, charioteer, and horses had all fallen off of a cliff, making her look away and giving Cuchulainn the advantage he needed to defeat her.

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#28 [url]

Aug 26 09 3:27 PM

If it is Cuchulain, I'm kinda hoping he is dead, I think that would cause less pain for Scatty and Aoife. 'Cause if he ends up making an appearance --and Scatty gets back to this time-- , wouldn't you think that would start the whole feud between them over again? I don't think it would be particularly helpful to the cause --assuming Aoife is on our side-- if Scatty and Aoife were fighting over a boy on the sidelines while trying to stop the Dark Elders...

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#29 [url]

Aug 26 09 4:43 PM

Could this be the reason why, when Sophie asks about her past relationships, Scatty looks at her reflection in the shop window? After all, if she and Aoife are twins then she must see Aoife every time she looks into a mirror. Perhaps in that instance she was looking at herself but actually seeing her sister and bringing up all those memories.

I'm assuming that the memories connected to this aspect of her past aren't particularly happy ones, so I think it's natural that she wouldn't be too forthcoming about revealing them to someone she only met a few days ago, no matter what else she may already have told them.

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#30 [url]

Aug 26 09 7:34 PM

I wonder, which of them is the "big sister?" Scathach? Aoife? I know that one child of most sets of twins is slightly older than their sibling, like Sophie. I personally think it's Aoife, but I could be wrong.

Also mfm13, when you mentioned that Scathach might only see Aoife in the mirror, it got me thinking. What if Scatty lives in her sister's shadow ("shadow" pun not intended ). Aoife is said to be more skilled than Scathach, and I wonder if that's another reason Scatty herself left, to make a future and reputation for herself where she wouldn't be eclipsed by her sister... I hope this made sense.

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#31 [url]

Aug 26 09 8:15 PM

QUOTE (Indigo Spirit @ August 26, 2009 07:34 pm)
I wonder, which of them is the "big sister?" Scathach? Aoife? I know that one child of most sets of twins is slightly older than their sibling, like Sophie. I personally think it's Aoife, but I could be wrong.

Also mfm13, when you mentioned that Scathach might only see Aoife in the mirror, it got me thinking. What if Scatty lives in her sister's shadow ("shadow" pun not intended    ). Aoife is said to be more skilled than Scathach, and I wonder if that's another reason Scatty herself left, to make a future and reputation for herself where she wouldn't be eclipsed by her sister... I hope this made sense. 

I can tell you for a fact that Aoife is the elder twin.

Haha, 'shadow'.

Michael Scott said that Aoife is 'twice as dangerous' as Scathach on Twitter, and I agree that that could be at least part of the reason why Scatty left, although I do think that she also has a genuine interest in protecting humani too.

It's just that that passage where Scatty was looking at her reflection in the shop window made much more sense to me in that respect after reading the extract. I get the idea that in that moment when Sophie was wondering what Scatty saw when she was looking in the window she was reliving this 'falling out' between herself and Aoife.

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#32 [url]

Aug 26 09 8:28 PM

According to me anyway both were always be jealous of one of the other one and can be when scatty left his(her) sister felt abandonée or something in the kind(genre). And after he(it) has had the problem of love there..
Finally it is of what I think without having read the volume 3.

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#33 [url]

Aug 26 09 8:36 PM

I know I'm coming in late on this discussion but where did the idea that Scatty and Aoife are twins come from?

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#34 [url]

Aug 26 09 8:47 PM

QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 08:36 pm)
I know I'm coming in late on this discussion but where did the idea that Scatty and Aoife are twins come from?

The fact that they look exactly the same - to the point that Sophie and Josh mistake Aoife for Scatty when they meet her at the beginning of 'The Necromancer'.

There's also the fact that they are portrayed as twins in many versions of the legend.

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#35 [url]

Aug 26 09 9:01 PM

I did a little research (in the past 2 minutes) and found many references to them being "mirror like" but not twins. Your reflection looks like you but most times is depicted as completely opposite.
I've known siblings to look close enough to be twins but are 18 months apart – maybe this is a reference to the quote “Irish-twins” who are really 12 months apart.

I also found out that Scatty trained Cuchulainn who may have been intimate with her but there was never a reference of love. So I don't believe that she lied when she said she has never loved anyone.

He was also intimate with Aoife who then had a son named Connla who grows up and is killed in battle by Cuchulainn (unaware of his relation). Cuchulainn also was intimate with Uathach (Scatty's daughter). I would think any of these could be the source of why Scatty looked sad at her reflection.

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#36 [url]

Aug 26 09 9:17 PM

QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:01 pm)
I did a little research (in the past 2 minutes) and found many references to them being "mirror like" but not twins.

The last line of the extract of 'The Necromancer' is Aoife saying 'I want to know what you have done with my twin sister'.

QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:01 pm)
I also found out that Scatty trained Cuchulainn who may have been intimate with her but there was never a reference of love. So I don't believe that she lied when she said she has never loved anyone.

How would that explain Scatty and Aoife having a falling out over a boy?

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#37 [url]

Aug 26 09 9:35 PM

QUOTE (mfm13 @ August 26, 2009 09:17 pm)
QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:01 pm)
I did a little research (in the past 2 minutes) and found many references to them being "mirror like" but not twins.

The last line of the extract of 'The Necromancer' is Aoife saying 'I want to know what you have done with my twin sister'.

QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:01 pm)
I also found out that Scatty trained Cuchulainn who may have been intimate with her but there was never a reference of love. So I don't believe that she lied when she said she has never loved anyone.

How would that explain Scatty and Aoife having a falling out over a boy?

Okay, first a big "duh" on my part about the twin. I just found it hard to believe that another set of twins were being introduced flamelssecret/crying.gif

As for Aoife, her son was killed by the boy that Scatty trained. She could easily blame Scatty for giving him the ability to kill her only son.

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#38 [url]

Aug 26 09 10:15 PM

QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:35 pm)
QUOTE (mfm13 @ August 26, 2009 09:17 pm)
QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:01 pm)
I did a little research (in the past 2 minutes) and found many references to them being "mirror like" but not twins.

The last line of the extract of 'The Necromancer' is Aoife saying 'I want to know what you have done with my twin sister'.

QUOTE (Lucothea @ August 26, 2009 09:01 pm)
I also found out that Scatty trained Cuchulainn who may have been intimate with her but there was never a reference of love. So I don't believe that she lied when she said she has never loved anyone.

How would that explain Scatty and Aoife having a falling out over a boy?

Okay, first a big "duh" on my part about the twin. I just found it hard to believe that another set of twins were being introduced flamelssecret/crying.gif

As for Aoife, her son was killed by the boy that Scatty trained. She could easily blame Scatty for giving him the ability to kill her only son.

Wouldn't that be kind of harsh? I mean, I think that someone would be more inclined to blame the guy who actually killed their son (which, as it happens, was a mistake anyway) rather than the one who trained him. Also, we don't know that Connla even exists in this story.

I'm not disregarding your theory - I think that, especially due to the brevity of the extract, it could go in a few different directions - I just feel that the connotations of the way in which Aoife describes it ('About a boy') suggest the kind of argument that two teenagers might have over a guy rather than the sort of fight that would arise from someone blaming a person for their son's death.

Then again, as I said before, the extract is very short and doesn't reveal an awful lot, and Michael Scott has been know to throw us a few curve balls before!

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#39 [url]

Aug 26 09 10:25 PM

Since we are talking about the Elders (and Aoife) I wanted to run something else past you ...
We know from the books that Mars was married to The Witch. We also know that Bastet was Mars' sister. We also know that The Morrigan is Bastet's niece ... does that mean that The Morrigan is Mars and The Witch's daughter? Also, since Scatty and Aoife are granddaughters of The Witch, does that make The Morrigan their mother?

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#40 [url]

Aug 26 09 10:47 PM

I could be wrong, but I think Michael has posted that the Morrigan is NOT Scatty and Aoife's mother before. Pretty sure, anyway. I think people are related in there but not by blood, or something. Again, this might be where a family tree of some kind would be helpful?

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